Thread is locked.

Are Jets Overpowered?

MommyFrowny
US Enlisted: 2011-10-26
2013-03-26 10:27
Archangel990 said:
We aren't impossible to take down, lol.

Just get a bit better in the jet yourself and handle your team's air superiority on your own.

No ace is invincible.

Our effectiveness also goes down exponentially with the number of lock on weapons on the map at any time. An ace can almost be useless if facing a combination of stingers, heatseeker jets, and heatseekering helicopters. It'll take us a few minutes to clear our areas in that situation, which is a lot of leeway for ground troops.



If you want to deal with an ace, essentially, use teamwork. Otherwise, you'll get smashed. That's how Battlefield works; not this ridiculous 'rock-paper-scissors' system that so many of you want.


I've chased aces long enough where they lost sense for a moment and plowed into something. Or had them tail me while a wingman gunned him down. Sometimes I died, spawned in a jet and managed to get behind an ace and shoot him down. I'm even guilty of jet-ramming a few simply because I couldn't manage any other way to get them down. I'm not proud of that, but it is a last-ditch option. My point is, they aren't invulnerable.

As echoed before, jets are the top of the chain. But in the end, the operator is human and prone to making a mistake somewhere, you just need to force them into it somehow. And for crying out loud, a single pilot cannot control the entire field and getting 2 top-aces is VERY rare. One person may be able to do a lot of damage, but there are areas that are inaccessible to most pilots (like the inside of a building).

"Jets SHOULD control ALL air and ground vehicles. BUT jets should NOT be able to come into meters of the battlefield and destroy enemy infantry. They need to stay up in their kingdom of the sky and take out vehicles to help their infantry units advance and take and keep objectives. Jets are NOT the gods of the game. Every class/vehicle has a role in this game. If you step outside of that role you SHOULD be killed because your stepping into someone elses kingdom. ;) "

There are numerous ground hazards, plus any tanks/rpgs that may come your way. It is not as if a jet is invincible.

Honestly, learning enough to be a threat in a jet isn't hard or rocket science, it takes time. I kept getting owned by pilots and instead of coming up with excuses to nerf them, I learned (with help) how to fly like them and counter them. Everything does adhere to a rock-paper-scissors type of gameplay, but sometimes the weaknesses are not so obvious.
Karl_Smith1974
GB Enlisted: 2012-01-16
2013-03-26 10:32
If they hadn't put them in can you imagine how boring Air Superiority would be right now?
Sir, you have just won the internet, or proved that you're a moron!
Goooos3
AU Enlisted: 2011-12-11
2013-03-26 12:05
There's a pretty simple counter to Jets: 18 maps in All of BF3 that have NO jets to spawn in. There are only 11 maps in Conquest that have Jets it them. if you don't want to take on jets, go to these servers. You'll often find the jet whores on jet maps anyway, so you might not feel so butthurt.
BF3 ACW-R - All my <3
Gordorad2
US Enlisted: 2012-07-19
2013-03-26 12:47
JaFool1 said:
So because someone has taken the time to master a vehicle and you cannot destroy them with your one shot lock on skill cannon, they should be removed from the game completely?
battlefield > life
Xritke
US Enlisted: 2012-11-24
2013-03-26 13:10
soulja224466 said:
Xritke said:
Jets are easy to master.
If you have mastered a jet, you can easily take one out with a tank and attack helicopter since you can basically foresee what they're going to do.
107 combined flanker/hornet kills lol. U haven't mastered anything dude.I am never killed by tanks or choppers.only light poles and good pilots counter jets, which is the way it should be. Top of the food chain and all...

Never in my sentence did I say that I had mastered jets.
I know people who have and seen what they can do.
[img]http://g.bf3stats.com/360/bhRcix1o/Xritke.png[/img]
soulja224466
US Enlisted: 2012-04-15
2013-03-26 13:55 , edited 2013-03-26 13:58 by soulja224466
Obviously those people haven't mastered them either if they're getting shot down by tanks and choppers.

As for the central argument in this thread, archangel nailed it .I 'm curious what changes OP is proposing?
Xritke
US Enlisted: 2012-11-24
2013-03-26 14:13
Obviously you didn't read my post correctly.
Let me explain it more clearly. When someone who has mastered a jet uses a tank or AH, they can easily take out a jet because they can easily predict what that pilot is going to do next.
[img]http://g.bf3stats.com/360/bhRcix1o/Xritke.png[/img]
soulja224466
US Enlisted: 2012-04-15
2013-03-26 16:45 , edited 2013-03-26 16:46 by soulja224466
Xritke said:
Obviously you didn't read my post correctly.
Let me explain it more clearly. When someone who has mastered a jet uses a tank or AH, they can easily take out a jet because they can easily predict what that pilot is going to do next.


And I'm saying that's nonsense. But I wouldn't have even replied to your post if not for your assertion that jets are easy to master. Just struck me as ironic that someone with 100 jet kills felt qualified to speak on the matter so definitively.

Hope that helps
LegitComp
Enlisted: 2013-02-24
2013-03-26 17:05
JaFool1 said:
So because someone has taken the time to master a vehicle and you cannot destroy them with your one shot lock on skill cannon, they should be removed from the game completely?


He's just a scrub, butt hurt because the fact he can't fly jets.
"Once more into the frey, into the last good fight I'll ever know, live and die on this day, live and die on this day."- The Grey
EnamouredCargo
AU Enlisted: 2012-07-10
2013-03-27 16:57
I did say no complaining or anything but guess yous can't read. I made this post not because (i am a cry baby and i have no skill), i do understand that yes they should be able to take out jets and other aircraft very well but at-least let them do that and not dominate the ground as well, just let them have the cannon but do a little less damage. The majority of you saying "get into a get and take them down, it only takes one other jet to kill them or take them down". umm sorry but that is not true, 99% of the time yous just do the circle of death and the ace pilots just destroy you straight away, not giving you a chance and the fact that jets can out fun stingers is not balanced. This is just an idea but i reckon they should remove a bit of range on stingers against jets but make it so that jets cannot out run the missile, therefor making jets think twice about going too low to attack ground units and tanks, giving them a feel of danger when they try to :)
whoisAEK
US Enlisted: 2011-12-27
2013-03-27 18:31
Archangel990 said:
We aren't impossible to take down, lol.

Just get a bit better in the jet yourself and handle your team's air superiority on your own.

No ace is invincible.

Our effectiveness also goes down exponentially with the number of lock on weapons on the map at any time. An ace can almost be useless if facing a combination of stingers, heatseeker jets, and heatseekering helicopters. It'll take us a few minutes to clear our areas in that situation, which is a lot of leeway for ground troops.



If you want to deal with an ace, essentially, use teamwork. Otherwise, you'll get smashed. That's how Battlefield works; not this ridiculous 'rock-paper-scissors' system that so many of you want.




I could've sworn I've seen you in another thread......weren't you in that one thread where me and some dumbass kept going back 'n forth on spawn-raping, and the guy had a 1K/D or something and was trying to defend shit players like him?

ANYWAY!
zFonzy
IE Enlisted: 2011-10-28
2013-03-27 18:41
EnamouredCargo said:
once you get a person who knows everything about them and knows everything to do in them,


Yes, because there's loads of them in every lobby, **rolls eyes**
zw1ck
US Enlisted: 2011-11-03
2013-03-27 18:57
I've never seen a pilot that couldn't be taken down by a couple of engineers with stingers. There are some that make you work for it but none can stand against even a noob with basic knowledge of how a stinger works.
Kolmiopaavo
FI Enlisted: 2011-11-01
2013-03-27 22:59 , edited 2013-03-27 23:04 by Kolmiopaavo
EnamouredCargo said:
I did say no complaining or anything but guess yous can't read. I made this post not because (i am a cry baby and i have no skill), i do understand that yes they should be able to take out jets and other aircraft very well but at-least let them do that and not dominate the ground as well, just let them have the cannon but do a little less damage. The majority of you saying &quot;get into a get and take them down, it only takes one other jet to kill them or take them down&quot;. umm sorry but that is not true, 99% of the time yous just do the circle of death and the ace pilots just destroy you straight away, not giving you a chance and the fact that jets can out fun stingers is not balanced. This is just an idea but i reckon they should remove a bit of range on stingers against jets but make it so that jets cannot out run the missile, therefor making jets think twice about going too low to attack ground units and tanks, giving them a feel of danger when they try to :)


Do you mean rush jet cannon? Because the conq jet cannon is a joke against armor, there is absolutely nothing to complain about it. It takes 3 shots to kill infantry, and only the most skilled pilots can kill infantry with jets. As mentioned above jets are not unbalanced, i feel they are very close to balanced. Myself i can run over +10 kd matches easily with jets, but it dosent mean jets are unbalanced. We are on the top of the food chain for a reason.

And coming about ace pilots in publics, how often do you even meet them? Because i feel in 90% matches i dont even meet a real challenger. Most pub games are just filled with crappy noob pilots who are completly useless in the jet, leaving ground targets alone.

What might cause the "unbalance" of jets is because there are usually no-one in the other team to counter the ace pilot, leaving the ace pilot alone and letting him focus on ground targets. But when another ace pilot joins the game and starts fighting against me, then 90% of my time goes to dogfigting, leaving ground alone. For example, when i were playing scrims, i had usually the smallest amount of score in my team alongside with my wingman because our all time just simply goes on dogfigting the other pilots. It is about more skilled players, not about owerpowerness of jets
EnamouredCargo
AU Enlisted: 2012-07-10
2013-03-29 06:27
yeah the rush Cannon needs a little less damage and yes true but for some reason the other ace pilot usually changes teams
BloodFatality
US Enlisted: 2012-01-23
2013-03-29 09:35
Cloud
Sleeping on Iron Giants
KingGladiator88
Enlisted: 2011-10-27
2013-03-29 13:40
EnamouredCargo said:
yeah the rush Cannon needs a little less damage and yes true but for some reason the other ace pilot usually changes teams

DO YOU KNOW WHAT THOSE JETS SHOOT!?!? [en.wikipedia.org] They fire 30mm armor piercing incindiery rounds [en.wikipedia.org] The bullets from those things are FOUR INCHES(10cm) long.

Even if the rounds dont penetrate the armor, it will shear the armor off, which means the armor that has been impacted, even if the rounds never penetrated, would ripple and come apart inside the tank making a giant shrapnel chamber, killing everyone.


By the way, no jets are not OP. If you have 3 people with AA rockets, you can create a net where the pilot would get locked on by one missile, flare, then get caught inside another persons launch area and be caught defenseless.

Its a multi million dollar killing machine, what makes you think you should kill it because your rocket (which isnt even your primary weapon) can lock onto it and you have developed the skill to look at the sky through a scope for 3 seconds while pressing LT?
Dip, dip, potato chip. Dip, dip, potato chip.
i_ivanof
BG Enlisted: 2011-12-12
2013-03-30 12:54 , edited 2013-03-30 12:55 by i_ivanof
EnamouredCargo said:
Jets are overpowered, once you get a person who knows everything about them and knows everything to do in them, they just dominate everything and i mean everything on the BF

So, you are saying that just because someone is butthurt of being constantly shot down, he should have a magical weapon that lets him kill the skilled pilot mowing his ass down? lol you are pathetic
EnamouredCargo said:
They really shouldn't of put them in
Air superiority is one of the most important factors to wining a war in modern times, why? because jets can take down anything whenever they fee like it. and it takes a lot to bring them down. They have limited usefulness in BF3 yet you still bitch about them, this is just sad.
EnamouredCargo said:
They are as hard as anything to blow up since they can fly faster then the missile and the flares come back way to fast, they are unbalanced.
they cannot fly faster than the missile you fucking retard, and 10 seconds reload time is a lot, most pilots use ECM anyway

EnamouredCargo said:
Nooo haters and people saying im a noob and i suck, i'm serious about this
well you just said it yourself here, though, since you are a noob ad you suck, you deserve to get killed and adapt to the game. This means: get good at jets or get killed by them, not bitching on the forums because you want the game to be easier, it doesn't work that way
proud founder and leader of the AN-94 MASTER RACE
EpicToast34
US Enlisted: 2012-12-27
2013-04-04 04:31 , edited 2013-04-04 04:34 by EpicToast34
Treborlavok said:
Archangel990 said:
Treborlavok said:
To control the air by taking down choppers and jets. and taking down tanks from a distance.

But obviously that isnt enough for some people. They feel they should be able to take on entire teams in their jet and live because, &amp;amp;quot;im in a jet and i put the time in to become an ace pilot so i should get to kill anyone and everything no matter what.&amp;amp;quot;

like i said, if your in a jet and you get too close to the ground you SHOULD be afraid your GOING to get shot down. But as it is now, jets have nothing to fear. just get below radar and boost to get out of range. Jets are and should be powerful. but it shouldnt take an entire squad to take down 1 jet pilot from the ground. Do the math and then think about the balance in the game... someone else said it too. 2 ace pilots on the same team, respectfully takes roughly 2 squads working together to take them both down. Thats 8 ppl trying to take down 2 jets... while the rest of the enemy team is attacking on the ground leaving how many more members of your team to try and defend the ground...? Now tell me... how is that balance?

Theres amazing tank drivers/teams out there. but it doesnt take an entire squad to take them down, and it shouldnt. Tanks excel at their role to control the ground units and CAN be taken down. Jets on the other hand, excel at taking down air units AND ground/infantry units and have nothing to fear.
Of course it isn't enough... we're good enough to keep pushing our envelopes. Jets have the highest skill-cap of anything in this game, but to compensate they also have the steepest learning curve. Evidence of that? Look up how many jet tutorials are on Youtube versus tutorials on any other aspect of BF3.


No, the role of jets in this game is not to simply control air and harass tanks at long distance. Jets are the rulers of the battlefield. Their role is to destroy whatever they can, at all times, so their team can win the game more easily. Why do you think DICE gave them the most powerful arsenal of anti-vehicle weapons in the entire game?


Also, it actually doesn't take an entire squad to take down jets. Not even close, pal. You know how many people it takes? One. Another jet pilot. And unless the enemy pilot is a crack-ace, it's very easy to take the jet out. What's the only requirement for such a thing? A bit of skill. But GOD NO. Any mention of that awful word makes you cringe, doesn't it?


And that part about taking nearly an entire team to take out two skilled players... how is that unique to jets? It appears as though you simply reek of bias.

Listen, pal... if you want balance, here it is: jet pilots cannot capture flags, so they are reliant upon the teammates they protect to do that for them. We cannot do whatever we want, because our role is not all-encompassing. That is what the rest of the team is for. Wait a sec... that smells like... teamwork? In Battlefield? *gasp*


Lastly, I'd just like to point out the fact that you're basing all your boundless knowledge on the so-called 'invincibility' of good pilots on the fact that it takes you, literally, ten minutes to get a kill in either CQ jet. Where do your observations come from? How do you know how easy it is to survive in a jet while actually maximizing your attacking potential? I don't think you do.
You seem to be missing my point entirely. Im not talking about the pilots staying in the air like they should. im talking about the pilots that harass the infantry units. Plain and simple, if you get too close to the battlefield you SHOULD be shot down. Jets are extremely effective and rightfully should be. They do have a high learning curve, but so do attack choppers.

Do your math again... 1 squad of 4 to take on 1 jet pilot attacking infantry units... thats 1 eng= flares 3 more eng= disable and then kill. Thats all IF the pilot doesnt get down below radar before the second stinger/igla goes off. So even in the best scenario, thats MAYBE 3 infantry to take down 1 pilot. MAYBE.

Now again, do that math with 2 ace pilots on the same team. Thats, again best case scenario, 6 players to take down 2 jet pilots. Leaving the remaining 6 players vs 10 other ground/infantry and possibly chopper units. Now again... tell me why 1 ace pilot, should be able to tie up 1/4-1/2 of the enemy team?

I swear this community is the worst when it comes to talking about something like adults... everyone instantly starts acting like theyre 12. &quot;o get good bro, u mad bro, its called skill learn it, teamwork bro its the name of the game.&quot; The facts are all there that the jets are unbalanced. like i said give them a reason to stay &quot;above radar&quot; and far enough away from the ground while keeping their ability to take down air and mobile ground units. IF you get &quot;below radar&quot; know that your GOING to get shot down. stay in the air and control the vehicles like you should. Your teams ground/infantry units will handle the enemy infantry on the ground and take the objectives.

As a good pilot yourself, you should know that if you get disabled you..... bail. So go on, tell me again how horrible i am flying a jet and keep trying to change the subject. ;)


Just mad cuz you can't take out a jet on your own.
And jets are not Op.
You can kill the pilot with a shotgun, or even a pistol.
Proof? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=crwhsTlSJxg [youtube.com]
Hi
Bfizzle62
US Enlisted: 2012-02-29
2013-04-04 04:49
I feel like making a witty response entirely in wingdings
Do not argue with an idiot, otherwise they will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience
 
Thread is locked.
Thread is locked.